Bending better depron airfoils

by apnewton | May 3, 2014 | (25) Posted in How To

What's the problem

In Australia we can't get Dollar Tree foamboard but there are some alternatives. I have settled on 6mm depron from Tradewarehouse as my favourite building material. 

Inspired by the great reviews of the 2m Radian EP motor glider I wanted to build something similar using Experimental Airlines and Flite Test methods.

Here's what I came up with. 2m (79") wingspan, flying weight 750g (27oz).

It looked great but flew hoooooorribly. The plane would climb OK initially but then loop up and wobble when trying to fly level, even with the CG way forward and motor angled down. Then there was the glide slope, or lack of one. It continually stalled and just dropped out of the sky.

Wing loading was only 6.5oz/sq ft, and no amount of CG or thrust angle changes improved the stability. The wing wasn't flexing or twisting excessively. 

The only variable left was airfoil shape. I started to suspect that my 5" airfoil was too fat. Following ExAir's Armin wing instructions but using 6mm depron and a 7.5mm spar, my version was ending up 26mm thick compared to Ed's 20mm. Back to the drawing board.

As a reaction to that disappointment the next wing I build was 1.2m and super slim, only 20mm thick and 6.5" airfoil with 1.5" ailerons. It flew beautifully, smooth and controllable and even glided really well. Big surprise.

 

Then, further encouraged, I made a symmetrical wing slope soarer with a slim airfoil. This one is 20mm thick and 5.5" airfoil plus 2" ailerons and it flies like magic. The tape covered depron tends to automatically bend into the symmetrical section, I just encouraged it by lifting the trailing edge of the bottom layer a little as it was glueing.

For a flat bottomed section you need to press the wing down flat while gluing.

The maximum thickness still looked too far forward comapred to production wings so the investigations continued.

Airfoil design

For inspiration I looked at the Bixler 2 wing, which glides beautifully, and the widely used Clark Y airfoil.

The key features are ... maximum thickness is less than 12% of the total chord and positioned 30% back from the leading edge.

I made up a variety of airfoil sections ranging in chord length (including ailerons) from 6.5" to 9.5" using my variation of ExAir's Armin wing. Explained below in more detail.

The combinations that most closely matched the Clark Y airfoil were:

A. 7.0" chord (5.5" plus 1.5" aileron) Spar 53mm back from the leading edge, no extra former over the spar.
B. 8.0" chord (6.5" plus 1.5" aileron) Spar 61mm back with a 3mm former layer over the spar.
C. 9.5" chord (7.5 plus 2" aileron) Spar 76mm back with a 6mm former layer over the spar.

To my eye these sections looked much nicer than my previous builds and a lot closer to commercially produced RC gliders and planes. Depron tends to kink rather than bend smoothly over the formers if the curve is too great but it's not a problem with these slimmer sections.

These have become my standard wing chord designs now. I would add larger 2" ailerons for aerobatic models, especially slope soarers. Varying degrees of airfoil section symmetry can be built-in by varying how much you press the wing down flat while gluing up.

Time to revisit the 2m wing. I made this one with a swappable nose section so it could be a slope soarer or motor glider.

This is a big success, my favourite sloper now, smooth, languid and majestic in the sky. It flies in winds ranging from 8kn to 25kn at my nearby slopes and behaves just as I hoped.


Wing construction

Here is my standard wing building method using 6mm unskinned depron and 7.5mm Skyshark P4X wrapped CF spars from kitesandfunthings. I'll make a video and add it here eventually.

Cover one side of the 6mm depron with packing tape. I have used PPS and Scotch tapes and prefer the cheaper PPS. There is no paper on depron so the tape is needed for strength and to achieve smooth bends. A few mm overlap between each tape run is all that's required. 

Sand a 1" taper on the inside of the bottom trailing edge to conform with the top layer for gluing. I found it was better not to sand all the way down to the covering tape but to leave about 2mm thickness at the trailing edge. When glued down the trailing edge ends up 8mm thick which allows the aileron to better blend in to the overall airfoil shape.

For an accurate leading edge fold, make a slight dent line (with the other end of a pencil) along the inside surface. Don't make the dent too deep or you will end up with a very sharp leading edge.

Place the spar where you want the thickest part of the airfoil to be (like 30% back) and glue formers either side. I use 20mm wide lengths of depron with another 40mm layer on top of the spar depending on the chord length.

 

Links for materials and information

Experimental Airlines for designs and techniques

Tradewarehouse for bulk depron

Kitesandfunthings for CF spars

My RC flight blog

My Flickr

My Youtube

My website for underwater photography, kite aerial photography and RC flight

 

 


COMMENTS

PaladinDG on May 9, 2014
Thanks for sharing... MAN, I miss sloping on the pacific coast in northern California!!
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apnewton on May 9, 2014
Yes it's addictive and the only possible way of flying here a lot of the time. Calm days are rare.
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Wojethebest on May 9, 2014
Have you considered foamboard from (http://www.foamboards.com.au/store/store_foamboards)
Its a bit cheaper and it also has a paper covering If you have already considered it why did you chose that one over the foamboard(i am considering between the 2)
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apnewton on May 9, 2014
Yes I did investigate that, see my Foamboards in Australia article linked above. Red20 uses it with great success but I went for depron for the weight saving. I'm more in to gliders and slow flying than fast powered planes.
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28th St. Air on May 10, 2014
great article and info Andrew. i hope to try this with some dollar tree board soon.
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TEAJR66 on May 11, 2014
Great article. Nice planes. Maybe that first plane needs more HStab area. Plus, with that dihedral in that long of a span, your drag line gets raised pretty high. I bet that plane would fly beautifully with the wing mounted under the fuse and a larger HStab. Just a thought. Not much of a thought given that you have demonstrated building and flying skills far beyond my own.

Be safe and have fun,
Tommy
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apnewton on May 11, 2014
Thanks Tommy. I hadn't considered the drag line. It did fly a little better without dihedral but no improvement in glide slope. That wing is now on a Peace Drone and the tail is on the symmetrical wing sloper.
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phoenix on May 12, 2014
Can you please post more information on how you manufacture the airfoil using Depron?

I found that the only way I could get it to bend reliably along the right line along the length of the wing was to cut a groove where I wanted it to bend (i.e. leading edge, a little in front of the spar and just after the spar (assuming a single spar)) on the inside of the airfoil.

This worked but was very time consuming.
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apnewton on May 12, 2014
I'll record a video very soon, but all I do is dent the inside of the leading edge then bend up over a straight edged ruler or board. Same as Ed just that there's no paper to remove.
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Krivak957 on May 15, 2014
Very well done! While the EA and FT wings are functional and very easy to make, I have long suspected that the airfoils were not too efficient. I have dreamed of doing experimentation with different airfoils, but I could never find the time. Now, you have done the experiments and published the results! EXCELLENT. I think this is just what Ed/Chad/Josh etc. had in mind for the RC community: Sharing, not fighting. Thanks so much! Maybe I will be inspired to do my own experiments and publish like you did.
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apnewton on May 15, 2014
Thanks. It always amazes me what does fly. But the slimmer wings are working so much better for me.
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Krivak957 on May 15, 2014
"It looked great but flew hoooooorribly."

Haha! I just got the reference to David, our favorite Swede.
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apnewton on May 15, 2014
:-)

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stormboy on May 16, 2014
You've gone into a lot of detail with your post. Thanks heaps! Oh, and I love your use of colour on the planes. Orange tape looks great in the air!
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Drezed on July 23, 2014
Have you noticed any difference in flight characteristics, with different amounts of leading edge "rise" (as in distance of leading edge center to build table) v.s. a flat bottom airfoil(if that makes any sense)? Is there a method to insure consistent airfoil profile, from wing to wing(such as a mathematical solution in layout, or a jig)?
I've built a similar(semi-symmetrical) wing for my version of the "Dusty" model, with promising results. The tendency to climb with minor speed changes, exhibited by the flat-bottomed airfoil, is gone(so much so, I'll have to take out the down-thrust on the motor).
Thank you for your contributions, and keep the good work coming!

Jeff.
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apnewton on July 23, 2014
Thanks Jeff, good question. I haven't yet come up with any way to consistently shape the bottom curve. All I do is push down hard all over the wing to achieve a flat bottom, or push down not so hard for a curved bottom. Positioning of the spar (30% back usually) and where the trailing edges meet probably determine the overall shape more than any other factors.

Flight characteristics? The curved bottom needs less elevator input for inverted, rolls are more axial.

One problem is that it's trickier to mount the wing flat on the fuselage, I needed to tilt the wing forward by adding packing under the trailing edge on my 2m motor glider.
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dharkless on December 19, 2014
I like the exposure of your development process including the early disappointments. Nothing teaches like failure. Your process and end result are enlightening, The "2M Sloper" video is top notch. The airfoil development is impressive. Nice work!
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apnewton on December 20, 2014
Thanks D and congratulations on your brilliant "No Waste" builds.
With more experience I now think that original 2m dihedral motor glider wing was not level on the fuselage. I wish I had tried tilting it forward at the time.
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Aya on March 28, 2015
Great job.
I want to ask how did you determine the angle where the fuselage started to get narrow?
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apnewton on March 28, 2015
Pure guess work.I just cut out wedges from the walls where I think it will look good.
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Plattenwerk on March 5, 2016
My favorite tool for preparing bending the airfoil?
A fork. No kidding!
It grooves excellent parallel patterns into Depron. This avoids the ugly edges over the spar.
I start at the dent for the leading edge and make 9-12 parallel dents on the Upper side, using a straight edge as a rule. If necessary I do 2 dents at the underside for a smooth beginning of the LE.
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apnewton on March 6, 2016
Nice use of unusual tools. I can see that a fork would help with smooth bends
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Bending better depron airfoils